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Have Zeiss lost the plot again

Ming, it's a combination of both lens and sensor. The electronics are Imacon and the sensor is a 16 bit CCD.
 
There are a number of sensational news last few days.

I will defintely go for ZS 50 1.4, it will fit into my Contax and Leica system.

Canon remains to be the digital giant at the moment. Despite the fact that it does not produce the lenses which match our standard, she will remain in the stage for while. Will its role be replaced by Sony ?

I think she will.

Sony has emerged in the last few years as the second. Although Sony's sensor is not as good as Canon, it's pricing and quality to price ratio have not been matched by any other companies. The price is one of the most important determinant in the digital market.

Multidiciplinary approach is the key to success in the digital world. High performance digital camera certainly requires the combination of important components with high technological achievements. Canon has always been one company's play. Sony, with integrations from other companies like KM, and co-operations with Zeiss, will make an SLR system and this system will be better than Canon's.
 
... now that KM is out of photo business, many other companies will rethink their strategy and will decide, whether they want to follow Kyocera and KM or to continue to fight in this difficult market.

Im am not sure whether KM will be the last one this year
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Although the well known players all made now cooperation with big electronic giants to be able to survive, the KM ex&le showed, that this does not mean that later on it results in consequences the users hoped for.

I would watch Sony closely now. Sony inherits obviously the KM mount. And Sony has strong relationship with Zeiss because of its Cybershot and Camcorder business.

I do not think that the relationship has suffered too much because of the Zeiss/Nokia partnership (mobile phones), if there would be a big business opportunity for other products. And I do think that this opportunity is now there.

Sony gets the KM mount and Sony will get - on demand - also lenses produced by Minolta according to the press release of KM. IMO it would not make sense for Sony, if they would leave it with that. KM has a marketshare in DSLR market of around 3%. If Sony does not make it differently in the future than KM did in the past, they would stay at this marletshar or loose even more.

Therefore it is mandatory for Sony to survive in this DSLR business, that they do things differently. Using their sensors in future DSLRs with KM mount is the obvious next step- But IMO this is not sufficient.

So the best bet would be to offer something in cooperation with Zeiss lenses. This would make all future Sony/KM DSLRs different to the competition. They could market it agressively to gain market share. I do think that this is a very likely scenario. Both, Zeiss and Sony would profit of this DSLR cooperation.

The Nikon leses would be only a nice additional income on top of that. And a marketing possobility for other Zeiss DSLR combinations. Once a Nikon users enjoyed Zeiss glass, he meight be more willing to switch to Sony DSLR in the future.

Looking at the fact that KM has Antishake and Sony gets all assets from KM, this would result in a Sony DSLR with Sony Sensor, Antishake within those bodies and 2 lines of lenses: Minolta for cheaper prices (mass market) and Zeiss for the more demanding costumers (and deeper pockets).

The only thing that disturbs me is, that there would be no incentive anymore for Zeiss to look for a Contax cooperation partner, which would mean the death of the Contax hope.

Maybe Sony has still a joker in his hands for us Contaxians, but it seems for me, that this is onla at good will of Sony.

Whether a Sony/Zeiss System would be better than the Nikon/Zeiss combination ahs still to be prooven. Nikon showed what they are able to do. Sony ahs first to proove that they are able to meet very high expectations of demanding users. P&S is different (easier) than bridge camera users and DSLR users are even more difficult to satisfy in this competitive environment.

C/Y mount is AFAIK not copyright protected anymore. It is too old. But I fear that no camera manufactuerer is willing to risk to invest in a mnaual fokus system.

Just remember: Minolta withdrew yesterday and they sold 16 million lenses already. Canon announced the production of its 30 millionth EF lens yesterday. You can make the math, how mach the sales of KM decreased over the last years and Canon's increased (Canon has over 60% marketshare with DSLRs).

By the way, is it not surprising, that whenever a big news from one manufacturer is coming over the net, any kind of important or not so important Canon news is announced at the same day? This is excellent marketing
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Back to Contax: I do not know the complications with the N System to adapt to Sony DSLRs, But as long as Kyocera has to pay every year a high fee to Zeiss for the Contax brand, I am not sure whether it is in Zeiss interests to change this - considering the low sales in that system and their upside to stop the contarct without getting somewhere else the Contax royality fees
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So as a Contaxian, I am at the moment still very disappointed. As a Zeiss lens user and potential DSLR buyer, the future might look now better than 6 months ago.

So my advise would be to watch what is coming over the "Sony ticker".

Did I mention already that we have also Sony Forum in our photo community portal?
 
Thanks for the interesting posts; interesting times too. It will be interesting to see what happens. There may be a slump in current sales while informed potential purchasers take stock and wait and see.
 
Sony is an interesting company to be at play in this game. It is no stranger to marketing computerized electronics to consumers, and have a reputation for innovation and quality.

Remember, Sony is the maker of Play Station, Vaio and great TVs (my 42" Wega Plasma TV : -) They are also an entertainment giant. If any company can go toe to toe with Canon, it is Sony. If they expand into this photographic world as they seem to be doing, it will not be a small player the way Kyocera was.

Sony can also be stubborn. Obsolete video recording format, cameras that recorded directly to CD-ROMs, and now their insistence on Memory Sticks, to name a few. They also were caught asleep at the wheel by allowing Apple to be the inventor /marketer of the iPod right under their noses ... which should have been a Sony evolution from their pocket radio and entertainment assets. "Sony, the one and only." was once quite true.

The absorption of KM by Sony provides them with interesting technologies. Minolta has been fairly innovative in the area of electronics for cameras ( including many years of providing Leica with electronic solutions) ... with a weakness in Minolta lenses and some quality issues.

The challenge will be to slide into the market without trying to slug it out with Canon in certain segments of the market. Canon is poised to land yet another blow to Nikon's head. They have the next evolution in test already which will upset the apple cart
to no end I think. Meg count is about to take a major jump in Canon's DSLRs, and I am sure it is only a matter of time where their cameras will jump to a top ISO of 6400 or more.

Those that do not use Canon DSLRs cannot grasp that shots can be taken at ISO 1250/1600 that look like ISO 400 on other cameras, and even now ISO 3200 is perfectly useable and far exceeds film in low light. I also think there will be no cropped frame Canon DSLRs with-in 2-3 years ... they will all be full frame. Full frame allows the packing in of more megs than with APS sized sensors.

With this strategy, Canon has virtually taken over wedding photography, reportage, sports/racing photography, and many commercial applications ... which is irritating because some of their lenses leave a lot to be desired.

This is the real crux of the matter. Sony can do all sorts of things in the photo market, but it will mean nothing if they do not cement a relationship with a company like Zeiss for top end
optics ... especially wide angles like the Zeiss 21 and 28 ... it is Canon's Achilles heel. Without such an image leader DSLR/premium optics (like they have in TVs) it will be strictly consumer level stuff of little interest to serious photographers willing to pay a premium for tools that exceed what Uncle Bob has in his camera bag.

Where Kodak fits into all this is going to be interesting.
 
Talking of camera mounts, presumably the Nikon F mount must now be free of copyright for Zeiss to use it or have they done a deal with Nikon allowing them to use it?
 
Once a mount has a history of more than 50 years, other companies should be able to use them for free.
 
Hi John, The Nikon F mount went out of patent years ago, so Zeiss need do nothing. I think you will find all the old mf mounts are well out of patent, which is why Cosina were able to make the Voigtlander SL range of mf SLR lenses recently...including C/Y mount !! This why the ZF lenses are not EOS...patent does not expire for years yet I think and presumably Zeiss do not want to pay Canon for use of the EOS mount, for whatever reason, unlike Tamron who pay Canon. Cheers Steve.
 
Steve Moseley is correct about Voigtlander lenses for C/Y mount (B&HPhoto lists a 40mm and a 180mm) which raises the question -- why aren't Zeiss and Cosina offering new Zeiss lenses in C/Y mount? I find it hard to believe that there is a larger market for M42.
 
Hi Steve,

Thanks for that. I hadn't appreciated the nuances. Maybe CZ would have done better to pay for the EOS mount and just give in to the wave of EOS users rather than have a limited number of M42 plus adapter users and hope to capture all SLR makes with limited functions (awful word). Maybe this is a Cosina thing as their web site says - per Google translation!

" Universal mount M42
You adopt the lens mount * M42 for single-lens reflex which spreads most widely in the world. That screwing in type mount (the Thread Mount = TM), the domestic many camera manufacturer adopted, the lens of enormous number was made so far. The lens which even cultural inheritance of those mankind it should call, can be managed at this 1 unit."

I'd forgotten about the Cosina C/Y mount lenses. I fancy the 125. I was going to post a link but it was so long and difficult to read that I didn't bother. You've probably seen it anyway.

I wish Cosina would present an English language web site.
Cheers,
John
 
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