Dandelion applicability to SD14

guardian

Member
I'll open with the question: If it existed for the Sigma SD14, would a dandelion be applicable to this camera?

My knowledge on this subject is severely limited, which I why I'm seeking your counsel. I know dandelion devices exist for other camera makes, e.g., Nikon, Canon, Olympus, to facilitate focus confirmation when MF lenses are used on those cameras. The dandelion is needed because on those other camera brands the built-in focus confirmation is intentionally defeated when the camera detects absence of a compatible AF lens. Since it's not necessary intentionally to defeat this feature under such circumstances, I assume this is something those other manufacturers include in their design in order to increase sales of their AF lenses.

None of that helps me. I own a Sigma SD14 camera. But I don't know whether Sigma follows the lead of those other manufacturers and defeats the SD14's focus confirmation when a MF lens is on the camera.

Any help and guidance will be appreciated.
 

tc95

Well-Known Member
I've been using MF lenses on my SD14 for years...the focus confirmation...sometimes works and most times does not...I would not trust AF confirmation chips...most of them are rated to a 50.14 lens...and your focus will be off with anything above an 85...tride and true method of just looking thru the view finder....

Now I have seen from time to time on eBay a split-prism that can be attached at the bottom of the actual camera prism...some-people like it and other don't...never tried one...

I have been luck so far that my site is still decent enough to get the shot...

It would be nice for Sigma to put an MF lens data-base in there camera like Nikon does...so you can just run with an MF lens...but this is like wishing on a star...(it will never happen)...

Tony C...
 

guardian

Member
I've been using MF lenses on my SD14 for years...the focus confirmation...sometimes works and most times does not...I would not trust AF confirmation chips...most of them are rated to a 50.14 lens...and your focus will be off with anything above an 85...tride and true method of just looking thru the view finder....

Now I have seen from time to time on eBay a split-prism that can be attached at the bottom of the actual camera prism...some-people like it and other don't...never tried one...

I have been luck so far that my site is still decent enough to get the shot...

It would be nice for Sigma to put an MF lens data-base in there camera like Nikon does...so you can just run with an MF lens...but this is like wishing on a star...(it will never happen)...

Tony C...
Interesting stuff about works sometimes and not others. I have seen it written elsewhere that an SD14, following first time insertion of a new charged battery, must be operated one time, a single click of the shutter, with an AF Sigma lens in place in order to initialize the (internal) computer. After that, it was said, you could take off the Sigma AF lens, substitute a MF lens, and retain focus confirmation . . . . until the battery once again must be changed out. I have not tried this procedure myself and do not know from personal experience whether it works . . . or not. The procedure conflicts with my preference for battery storage in the refrigerator.
 

tc95

Well-Known Member
Never heard about the battery thing...Would not help me with my current camera since I converted the mount to Nikon F... And one to Leica R...
 

guardian

Member
Never heard about the battery thing...Would not help me with my current camera since I converted the mount to Nikon F... And one to Leica R...
Yeah, for sure. I hear ya. But still, maybe. Here is my plan and then I will get back to your situation:

I have a really cheap, but authentic and fully functional, Sigma AF lenss. It is a Sigma 28-80mm F3.5-5.6 minizoom macro lens. I don't think there is a cheaper, or poorer, Sigma AF lens. But the lens is electronically valid and authentic, nevertheless. It's wicked poor glass, but electronically (only) it's every bit as good as any other Sigma AF lens. Anyway, that's the lens I plan to use to initialize my SD14. Put that sad glass in place, put in the battery, turn on the camera, take just one photograph (press the shutter button, anyway), and turn the camera off. Then, at that point with battery remaining in place, remove the Sigma AF lens and get on with my MF lenses (I have several nice ones). I would be using the Sigma AF lens for electronic purposes only.

Now back to you:

Seems to me you could try the same procedure except you would require a Nikon, any Nikon, AF lens. I apologize I know nothing of Nikon lenses. Does Nikon make a really cheap lens? Can you borrow a Nikon AF lens from a friend? There is no way for me to know, and I do not know. But I think you would have a chance initializing your computer with any lens that will autofocus on your camera. And in your case it looks as if that's going to be a Nikon lens . . . . or nothing at all.

Still, I know nothing of your conversion. If AF Nikon lenses are known not to autofocus on Sigma cameras, you could be toast.
 

tc95

Well-Known Member
Ya would love someone to come-up with a cool conversion for Sigma to AF nikon lenses...but as you can see it is very impractical....and would take too much modification...

You can Mod-A-Sigma to take Canon AF lenses...and communicate and completely work...not too difficult...But I was already invested in Nikon and Leica R glass to to make another jump...

Here are the two mods....that I own...

Leica-R SD14

DownloadedFile.jpeg

Nikon F SD14

DownloadedFile-1.jpeg

Nikon Contacts which make it almost impossible to work...on Sigma SD14...(someone with a-lot of time and a-lot more knowledge than me....could possible do it...)

DownloadedFile-2.jpeg


Now Luis Guevara...makes mount mods for Nikon/Leica-R/Oly and has info on his site for Canon Conversions...

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.... and his main thread...
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Good Luck with your tests...I would be interested in seeing what you come-up with...the only issue I see is that when you initialize the 28-80 lens...then your camera may think that is the lens that you have on the camera at all times...which will give you wrong info...unless you are using a 28-80 MF lens on the body...(I'm no expert...just seems...logical)...but I could be way off base...I do know on my Nikon D300/D2x if I have the wrong MF lens dialed in my focus is just off...not enough that you can not correct in post processing...but enough to be annoying...

I would defiantly like to know how it turns out...because if it does work well...there is no reason why I can't call sigma and buy the contacts and chips for a lens just to initialize on the body even with the conversions...all I would need would be the electronics, and something to hold it while I turn the camera on and work it...and the electronics can be taken off any lens then...I could buy a bummed lens off ebay to do this for under 100USD...

Again...Keep-us informed....Tony C.... :z04_cowboy:
 

guardian

Member
Ya would love someone to come-up with a cool conversion for Sigma to AF nikon lenses...but as you can see it is very impractical....and would take too much modification...

You can Mod-A-Sigma to take Canon AF lenses...and communicate and completely work...not too difficult...But I was already invested in Nikon and Leica R glass to to make another jump...

Here are the two mods....that I own...

Leica-R SD14

View attachment 2484

Nikon F SD14

View attachment 2482

Nikon Contacts which make it almost impossible to work...on Sigma SD14...(someone with a-lot of time and a-lot more knowledge than me....could possible do it...)

View attachment 2483


Now Luis Guevara...makes mount mods for Nikon/Leica-R/Oly and has info on his site for Canon Conversions...

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
.... and his main thread...
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


Good Luck with your tests...I would be interested in seeing what you come-up with...the only issue I see is that when you initialize the 28-80 lens...then your camera may think that is the lens that you have on the camera at all times...which will give you wrong info...unless you are using a 28-80 MF lens on the body...(I'm no expert...just seems...logical)...but I could be way off base...I do know on my Nikon D300/D2x if I have the wrong MF lens dialed in my focus is just off...not enough that you can not correct in post processing...but enough to be annoying...

I would defiantly like to know how it turns out...because if it does work well...there is no reason why I can't call sigma and buy the contacts and chips for a lens just to initialize on the body even with the conversions...all I would need would be the electronics, and something to hold it while I turn the camera on and work it...and the electronics can be taken off any lens then...I could buy a bummed lens off ebay to do this for under 100USD...

Again...Keep-us informed....Tony C.... :z04_cowboy:
Yes, I agree with you. First, if I understand correctly your conversion is designed to support Nikon MF lenses only. There is apparently no provision for anything to interface to the SD14 computer. It's a mechanical conversion only. If so, that's a difficult situation. I'm sorry to appear so stupid, but I have no personal experience whatsoever with mount conversions. None.

I also agree with your thinking, regarding my own situation, that changing out lenses could confuse the SD14 computer. I've no idea what will happen, and I don't understand anything about the handshake, on an SD14, between body and lens, vis a vis lens specifics. My hope is that the data exchange goes to lens type only, i.e., AF or MF . . . and stops there. This will become known in the fullness of time.

The entire dandelion phenomenon fascinates me. I still hope to learn if it's applicable to the SD14, or perhaps completely unnecessary. But the (to me) obvious injection of marketing priorities into the design of the other cameras (other camera brands) has really caught my attention. And given Sigma is primarily a lens manufacturer, it would be a REAL feather in Sigma's cap if they have treated their SD14 customers with the kind of respect not shown by the other camera manufacturers. By this I refer to the possibility Sigma might not have defeated focus confirmation in presence of a MF lens.

OTOH, if I'm completely full of prunes and Sigma has thought more about selling AF lenses and less about the needs of their SD14 MF lens customers, then we have to consider the possibility of a Sigma dandelion in order to defeat their evil marketing overreach. Goodness knows that for other camera makes these things are selling like hotcakes. Ebay is alive with them. They are affordable, too. I see them as a really positive development for folks like me unable to pay half a grand (or whatever large number of $$$) for a good AF lens.
 

guardian

Member
[Note: This is actually an edit to the post I just put up. I exceeded the ridiculous five minute limitation on edits, so I am forced to post this as a separate post.]

ETA

After further consideration it appears your thinking regarding the handshake might well be correct. It occurred to me to access the Dandelion programming instructions in order to learn operation of the other cameras. This with the thought SD14 might be similar.

Here is a Google page:

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Here is a Canon-specific page, just for reference:

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You can see this is complex stuff (at least it is for me) which will require study.

More I am thinking now that we need a Sigma dandelion, and that my lens trick might not work out, even as you suspected.
 

tc95

Well-Known Member
Let me know what you come-up with...right now I am busy at work...and do not have the time to look-into-this...but would like to find out what you come-up with...

Tony C. :z04_cowboy:
 

guardian

Member
Let me know what you come-up with...right now I am busy at work...and do not have the time to look-into-this...but would like to find out what you come-up with...

Tony C. :z04_cowboy:
Ha Ha I don't have time either, right now. I tried to get a handle on this but it is too complex for me quickly to master. It's going to take a while for me to get 'round to this . . . too many projects.

Am a little disappointed no other SD14 owners have chimed in here. This dandelion thing has seized the interest of lots of camera owners who wish to use MF lenses with focus confirmation, or who must use MF lenses for financial reasons. Funny, I was reading an item recently that said our older MF lenses are simply BETTER lenses than today's AF lenses. So that would be another reason to use them.

But regardless the reason one is using MF lenses, availability of focus confirmation would be sweet!
 

Arvo

Well-Known Member
On my SD14 I'm using that "replace battery, put the SA lens, take image, swap to M42" approach - focus confirmation does work this way (well, I do not use that option anyway - I focus just visually). Focus confirmation adapter could add usable focal length and aperture value information to image and probably we could skip using SA lens initially either.

What about converted cameras - the only way what I can imagine is to install this "dandelion" thing somewhere inside the camera. Canon/SA lens protocol differs from Nikon, Leica and other lens communications protocols anyway and using other systems AF lens do not help.

Somewhere on another forum Luis reported that dandelion programming didn't succeed with SD1 however - does that work with SD14, noone knows.

PS. I hope I understand correctly that "dandelion" is another name for "focus confirmation adapter"?
 

guardian

Member
On my SD14 I'm using that "replace battery, put the SA lens, take image, swap to M42" approach - focus confirmation does work this way (well, I do not use that option anyway - I focus just visually). Focus confirmation adapter could add usable focal length and aperture value information to image and probably we could skip using SA lens initially either.

What about converted cameras - the only way what I can imagine is to install this "dandelion" thing somewhere inside the camera. Canon/SA lens protocol differs from Nikon, Leica and other lens communications protocols anyway and using other systems AF lens do not help.

Somewhere on another forum Luis reported that dandelion programming didn't succeed with SD1 however - does that work with SD14, noone knows.

PS. I hope I understand correctly that "dandelion" is another name for "focus confirmation adapter"?
Yes, I think you are correct.

To see some actual dandelion devices for other cameras, look here:

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It is good to have your confirmation of success with the "replace lens" strategy for the SD14. Thank you very much for posting that! I think your post is extremely interesting . . . . . . . . . and important.
 
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